Flash Foxy's Girl Crew Ramble-Gunks
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Over a hundred years of women’s climbing experience was on tap at the Flash Foxy Gunks Girl Crew Ramble climbers’ panel at Rock and Snow.
Elaine Matthews, Julie Seyfert Lillis and Whitney Boland talked about women, climbing, and culture. “You couldn’t have put together a handful of women climbers in 1965. That has changed in the last 10 years,” Matthews said in response to the question how climbing has changed from panel moderator Shelma Jun, of Flash Foxy. |
Matthews Elaine started climbing in the Gunks in 1965 and Yosemite in 1968. She continues to climb in 2016 and climbs hard!
The things that have changed in the past 50 years are the crowds, the gear, and the women, Matthews innumerate.
The change in climbing culture quickly became one of the themes throughout the discussion.
Matthews, Lillis, and Boland learned to climb from men, with men, in a time before the popularity of climbing gyms and overall popularity of the sport. Climbing will be a sport in the 2020 Olympics. In the past two weeks there have been articles about climbing in GQ and the New Yorker.
The things that have changed in the past 50 years are the crowds, the gear, and the women, Matthews innumerate.
The change in climbing culture quickly became one of the themes throughout the discussion.
Matthews, Lillis, and Boland learned to climb from men, with men, in a time before the popularity of climbing gyms and overall popularity of the sport. Climbing will be a sport in the 2020 Olympics. In the past two weeks there have been articles about climbing in GQ and the New Yorker.
Women's Climbing Discussion PanelLtoR Elaine Mathews, Julie Seyfert-Lillis, Whitney Boland |
Flash Foxy- What are some differences in climbing today from when you started climbing? Elaine Mathews-There were hammers and pitons that you had to go like this with. There were ropes that, yeah, they were there to keep you alive but you wouldn't want to fall on them. No, it wasn't hemp. You really didn't want to fall on them too hard because then you'd have to buy a new one. Yeah. Putting in a piton you really had big muscles. I was much bigger than I am now. The delicate little climbing we do now. That's a major change. What did I say- the crowds,the gear, and the women. Back to the women. It's really wonderful to have you all climbing. |
Until recently the experienced climbers at any cliff outnumbered the inexperienced.
“There was a time when what mattered was that I was another person,” Lillis explained. There were so few climbers that gender wasn’t the important thing, being a climber was. Lillis has done first ascents in the Gunks and Wyoming, worked as a climbing guide for 20 years and been a contributor to national climbing magazines. Julie has lead women's trad climbing clinics throughout the northeast and at the Red Rock Rendezvous. She's been pictured numerous times in Rock and Ice and Climbing and in Dick William's Guide to the Gunks leading the big roof on Erect Direction.
Because the ratio of experienced climbers to inexperienced was so different when 50, 20, or even 16 years ago it was easier to find safe climbing partners and mentors.
The current atmosphere is different. Climbers in the Trapps no longer know everyone else and there are plethora inexperienced climbers or people on their first time out of the gym.
An audience member asked what to look for in mentor or climbing partner.
Another long time climber Pauleen added from the audience- “If someone cannot explain something to you, then they don’t know,” she said. Don’t accept ‘just do it’ from someone.
Use your gut, if something or someone doesn’t feel right don’t do it.
Boland strongly urged climbers to have their own goals.
“Figure out what inspires you and make it happen. The more experiences you have in the community the better,” Boland said.
Climbing with different people will expose you to different ways of doing things, also different kinds of support, or ‘rub some dirt on it and walk it off’ attitudes, both are important.
Many women in the audience were about to undertake their first trad climbs and ask questions about making the transition from sport to trad.
“There was a time when what mattered was that I was another person,” Lillis explained. There were so few climbers that gender wasn’t the important thing, being a climber was. Lillis has done first ascents in the Gunks and Wyoming, worked as a climbing guide for 20 years and been a contributor to national climbing magazines. Julie has lead women's trad climbing clinics throughout the northeast and at the Red Rock Rendezvous. She's been pictured numerous times in Rock and Ice and Climbing and in Dick William's Guide to the Gunks leading the big roof on Erect Direction.
Because the ratio of experienced climbers to inexperienced was so different when 50, 20, or even 16 years ago it was easier to find safe climbing partners and mentors.
The current atmosphere is different. Climbers in the Trapps no longer know everyone else and there are plethora inexperienced climbers or people on their first time out of the gym.
An audience member asked what to look for in mentor or climbing partner.
Another long time climber Pauleen added from the audience- “If someone cannot explain something to you, then they don’t know,” she said. Don’t accept ‘just do it’ from someone.
Use your gut, if something or someone doesn’t feel right don’t do it.
Boland strongly urged climbers to have their own goals.
“Figure out what inspires you and make it happen. The more experiences you have in the community the better,” Boland said.
Climbing with different people will expose you to different ways of doing things, also different kinds of support, or ‘rub some dirt on it and walk it off’ attitudes, both are important.
Many women in the audience were about to undertake their first trad climbs and ask questions about making the transition from sport to trad.
Jamie Grant, from NJ, and Amanda McGill, from Pa, came up to the Gunks to meet new people and get out of their comfort zones. They’re both sport climbers and knew the Gunks is all trad climbing but said
“Let’s just go”.
Trad leading is an animal like none other.
“If I’m not leading I’m not climbing,” is a quote attributed to Matthews. She explained that she didn’t mean following or sport climbing isn’t climbing but leading is different.
“Leading is what turns me on,” Matthews explained.
“How do you get over lead fear?” another woman asked.
“It changes when you’re on lead. You’re totally focused. It’s what happens in my head,” Boland said. “You’re more engaged”.
“Leading is a microcosm of your brain and your heart,” Lillis added.
One conversation that didn’t happen was a litany of sexism in climbing tales. The panel and audience both were more interested in talking about the beauty of climbing and how to do it better.
The mansplaining does happen. Lillis has been a guide around the Gunks for a long time acknowledged that frequently her male client gets asked for beta not her.
Perhaps in the past it was less so.
“I was drawn to climbing because it felt so equal,” Lillis explained about her start in climbing 20 years ago. “When I experienced sexism it was from someone not part of the climbing community.”
The other side of that is with more women climbing all the time the community of women climbers is growing and becoming a force.
Beta is better. “Because women climb differently than men,” Boland said. “The weight distribution is different.”
For a sport that newcomers think is all about arm strength, flexibility and coordination are really the key to climbing.
“I think women are better climbers," Lillis said.
Throughout the rest of the weekend women ages 20 to 66 with anywhere from 40+ years climbing experience to some who've only climbed outside once before got out on the damp cliffs. There were groups bouldering, trad climbing and top roping both Saturday and Sunday in the beautiful West Trapps while a few women avoided the rain by heading to Gravity Vault in Poughkeepsie.
Lillis also hosted two ½ day trad climbing clinics for interested participants.
The weekend was rounded out with an Adopt-a-Crag in partnership with GCC and Mohonk Preserve. The volunteers were able to spend the morning cleaning the existing Upper and Undercliff roads as well as building an entirely new temporary trail that climbers will be able to use this spring to access the cliff when construction on the Steel Bridge commences next April.
“Let’s just go”.
Trad leading is an animal like none other.
“If I’m not leading I’m not climbing,” is a quote attributed to Matthews. She explained that she didn’t mean following or sport climbing isn’t climbing but leading is different.
“Leading is what turns me on,” Matthews explained.
“How do you get over lead fear?” another woman asked.
“It changes when you’re on lead. You’re totally focused. It’s what happens in my head,” Boland said. “You’re more engaged”.
“Leading is a microcosm of your brain and your heart,” Lillis added.
One conversation that didn’t happen was a litany of sexism in climbing tales. The panel and audience both were more interested in talking about the beauty of climbing and how to do it better.
The mansplaining does happen. Lillis has been a guide around the Gunks for a long time acknowledged that frequently her male client gets asked for beta not her.
Perhaps in the past it was less so.
“I was drawn to climbing because it felt so equal,” Lillis explained about her start in climbing 20 years ago. “When I experienced sexism it was from someone not part of the climbing community.”
The other side of that is with more women climbing all the time the community of women climbers is growing and becoming a force.
Beta is better. “Because women climb differently than men,” Boland said. “The weight distribution is different.”
For a sport that newcomers think is all about arm strength, flexibility and coordination are really the key to climbing.
“I think women are better climbers," Lillis said.
Throughout the rest of the weekend women ages 20 to 66 with anywhere from 40+ years climbing experience to some who've only climbed outside once before got out on the damp cliffs. There were groups bouldering, trad climbing and top roping both Saturday and Sunday in the beautiful West Trapps while a few women avoided the rain by heading to Gravity Vault in Poughkeepsie.
Lillis also hosted two ½ day trad climbing clinics for interested participants.
The weekend was rounded out with an Adopt-a-Crag in partnership with GCC and Mohonk Preserve. The volunteers were able to spend the morning cleaning the existing Upper and Undercliff roads as well as building an entirely new temporary trail that climbers will be able to use this spring to access the cliff when construction on the Steel Bridge commences next April.
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